SPEAKER_01: 0:17

Hi, I'm Maiva and this is Raising with the Village, a podcast where real parents share real stories so we can all feel a little more connected on this wild journey of raising children. Today's guest takes us on a journey that begins long before motherhood officially started for her. From being a little girl who adored babies and dreamt of having a family of her own, to growing up in a world full of headlines about fertility fears, she carried that quiet worry with her in adulthood. Even though nothing medically suggested she should. In this episode, she shares how those early thoughts shaped her path to becoming a mother of three. We talk about welcoming her first baby, and the questions, surprises, and identity shifts that came with that new chapter. And then how her family continued to grow with two more children, each adding their own layer to her story of motherhood. It's an honest, thoughtful reflection on expectations, ideas, and the beautiful, messy reality of building the family that you once only imagined. Let's listen to Candida's story.

SPEAKER_00: 1:36

Hi, how are you? Hi, I'm good.

SPEAKER_01: 1:38

Good, okay.

SPEAKER_00: 1:39

Excited to be here.

SPEAKER_01: 1:40

Me too. I can't wait to hear your story. I'm so excited.

SPEAKER_00: 1:44

Can't wait to share it.

SPEAKER_01: 1:46

So let's start with quick introductions. Who are you?

SPEAKER_00: 1:48

Candida Fianco, 38, Mum of 3.

SPEAKER_01: 1:51

Okay, perfect. Um, let's get started then. Yeah, let's do it. So I think you wanted to share your experience of motherhood, sort of um the comparison between what you had imagined it was gonna be. Yeah. And the reality of what it was. It actually is, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 2:12

I feel like I've not ever shared my story apart from just with like mum friends in conversations. But I feel like I'm at a good point in my life now to kind of share what I've learned over the years. Yeah. Because I've been a mum now for almost eight years.

SPEAKER_01: 2:25

Good, good, good.

SPEAKER_00: 2:26

Which is uh it feels like a well, it is a long time in my lifetime, you know. Well, it's someone's lifetime, it is it is it is my son's lifetime, yeah. So it's a big chunk of my life, you know. It's the my all of my 30s. Yeah. Um, I've been a mum. So yeah, I feel like it's a good time to share.

SPEAKER_01: 2:41

Well, I think it's a good time to share, it's a good time maybe for us to learn. Yeah, definitely. Um, or at least just to listen to your story. Yeah. So shall we go back to the very beginning of it? Um when you were a tiny wee little game. Maybe uh do you want to tell me a bit more about your family, the family that you grew up in? Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_00: 3:02

So um my parents are from Ghana and they came came here in the 80s. Yeah, and um, they had three kids. My brother, well, my sister first, my brother four years later, and then my myself two years later. So between my sister and me, there was a six-year gap. Six years. And then me and my brother, two-year gap. Yeah. Um, and I'm the baby of the family. And yeah, we've grew up, we grew up in South London. Um, really, really lovely childhood. Just remember being around family, friends, um, always playing outside. Um, I've got some of the same friends that I had from really young that are still my friends today. Um, just a really happy childhood. I always felt loved. I think probably part of it is my birth order as well. I'm the youngest. So naturally for me, I think growing up was really easy because I always had my siblings as my almost second parents. So I never really had to worry about much. I always had them um and loads of family around. So yeah, I had a really, really wonderful childhood, and my parents like set me up for yeah, for life, really.

SPEAKER_01: 4:09

And it's lovely. I'm I'm loving that. That's such a strong start to life. Yeah, yeah, I love it. And so when you were uh that little girl, yeah, what was your view on becoming a mum at some point? Is that something you thought about?

SPEAKER_00: 4:25

You know, it's funny because when I was young, I was obsessed with babies. Like, I think my earliest story that I was told, which is one that followed me through, which my family always found funny, is my cousin, when he was a newborn baby, um, my parents and my auntie, they couldn't find me. They were looking around the house, like, where am I? I was two and a half at the time, two and a half, which is the age of my daughter now. And when they they went upstairs to find me, and I was holding my two-week old cousin. I'd taken him out of his cot and I was holding him in his in my arms at two and a half years old. And they said, Can you imagine? Can you imagine? And they or they always laugh about it today. They always like, oh my god, can you remember? You were two years old and you were holding, but I was always obsessed with babies, um, to the point where, which I don't think this is as funny, but one of my uncles was just like, She's gonna have a baby very young. Like, that's how obsessed she is with kids. So I always wanted to be a mum, always wanted to be, um, always wanted I wanted a younger sibling so desperately. But my mum told me, look, the next person in this family that's gonna have a baby is gonna be you. And at seven years old, you're thinking, that's not gonna be for a long time. But I accepted it. Um yeah, yeah, exactly. It was, it was though. So um, yeah, I always wanted to, always wanted to be a mum, um, loved, loved babies, but I guess like progressing through life, probably by the time I hit about 10, I didn't care about babies anymore. You know, I cared about friends and you know, you know, being with my girlfriends and you know, just living. Um, so it wasn't really something I kind of thought about at all. Um, even in my early 20s, I mean, I always I just kind of saw it as a rite of passage in my life, if that makes sense. So you knew it was gonna happen. Yeah, it was just like I I knew it was gonna happen. But I think growing up how in kind of a traditional Ghanaian household, you yeah, you go to school, you get as much education as you can, you get your job, you get married, and you have children. Like it was, it wasn't a thing of like, will I get married? It will I have kids. In my mind, the way I was kind of raised in my community and my family, it was just kind of a rite of passage kind of thing, like when it happens.

SPEAKER_01: 6:46

It was not a when it was it was not an if, it was a when.

SPEAKER_00: 6:49

Yeah, exactly. And I think now I think back, I'm like, oh my god, like wow, I actually just assumed this will happen because it it's not you don't just assume it, or you can. Um, but yeah, it just kind of I always thought it would happen for me because I just expected it, and it happened, I guess, to my parents and all of my parents' siblings. It was just kind of how life goes, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01: 7:10

So when did you meet with um that person that would keep you and created the family?

SPEAKER_00: 7:16

Yeah, so I met my husband um at 23. Okay, quite sure. Yeah, it was actually at the time it was really quite it was really young, yeah. But for both of us, he was 23 as well. So we met at a really young age. Um, and I think for both of us, when we met, neither of us were looking for, we're looking for our life partner. Like we both weren't. We'd both finished university a couple of years before. We were we both graduated in the financial crisis. So it was so hard at the time to get a job. Sorry. It was so hard to get a job at the time. So our minds were just thinking of getting a job, saving up, buying a property, or whatever else kind of was on our minds. Um, and I remember when when we did start dating, probably about six months in, and you know, we really fell for each other. Remember, we were both like, we were like found each other very young. Like we didn't expect to kind of end our dating life, like if that makes sense. Um, but it very it felt kind of final being with each other and at such a young age, so we kind of needed to get our heads around that. Um, but even then, I still looked at marriage and children still well into the future. I didn't still think about it as if it was something that was going to happen in the following years. I mean, at the time I was not even working my graduate position at the time, so it still was something in the future. Um, but I think a few years into our relationship, that's probably when I started to think about it. Because then I started to think about my age, and I was like, wait a minute, I don't want to get married at a certain age and have children, and then all of a sudden I was like, oh wow, that's actually not as far off far off as I thought.

SPEAKER_01: 9:05

What was the script in your mind? Um, did you have an age that you had always thought, oh, when I'm, I don't know, 25, when I'm 30, when I'm I you know, I never did.

SPEAKER_00: 9:15

I never had an age in my mind. Um, probably when I was younger, I would have expected it to be maybe mid-20s, but I was born in the 80s. So in the 90s, as a child, that was the average age that people were having children back in the 90s. But by the time I hit my um mid-20s, there was no chance. Like I was not ready at the time myself, but before the decade before, that was just normal. Um, so yeah, by the time I was in my mid-20s, um, it wasn't there wasn't an age I was necessarily thinking. But I'll be honest with you, um, looking at you know, all the fear-mongering in the press and you know what you would hear and seeing TV shows and talk shows. Of I remember starting to pay a bit more attention to what we people would say about fertility and this biological clock and things like that. That kind of started to get into my head a bit. Um, and I remember speaking to a friend, and we were how old was I? I was working at a PR agency at the time. So I think I was maybe 26. Oh well. 26 at the time. Well, at the time, I remember thinking at 26, I was speaking to a friend, I was like, oh, apparently there's this company, they do like a health MOT on your fertility to just see how long you've got left in terms of like your egg count and stuff like that. Those kind of things, I'd see them in the press, and we were like, should we do it? But we didn't. So I think I started to kind of think about my fertility in terms of my biological clock, and that was at 26, which is very young to even think about it. But I think in a world where I felt that they were telling women, by the time you're 30, you know, your fertility starts to decline. Like, and I'm no doctor, um, but looking back, I I should not have felt that way. Yeah, you know, as a 26-year-old, should have just been living my life.

SPEAKER_01: 11:02

I feel like it sounds a little bit too young to be worrying about fertility. Yeah, I'm not a doctor either.

SPEAKER_00: 11:08

Yeah, it it was it was, but that's just how when you see these headlines. I used to work in public relations, so I my job was always to be looking at newspapers, and these were the kind of head thing, headlines I would see different doctors or different experts. You know, one would say it's 40, one, you know, when your fertility starts to climb, one would say it's 30, one would say, you know, you just see different things all the time. So it was so confusing. Um, but yeah, definitely the age 30 stuck out to me.

SPEAKER_01: 11:37

Um so you said you had that conversation with your girlfriend at work. Um, is that a conversation you had with your partner as well?

SPEAKER_00: 11:44

No, no, because at the time we weren't thinking about kids. So I didn't have that kind of conversation with him. I think that probably would have scared him off. But no, I didn't have a conversation with him at all. No, it was just like a thing with friends, just to say, Oh my god, should we have a look at this? But it wasn't something I read too deeply into, but it probably would have been like that day when I'd seen something, but yeah, it wouldn't, it wasn't anything I was like necessarily yeah, rushing into at the time.

SPEAKER_01: 12:11

Okay, so moving forward to when you do start having that conversation with your partner, how old were you at that point?

SPEAKER_00: 12:18

When we actually decided that we wanted to start a family, um, we got engaged at 27 and or was that 28, about 28, and we got married at 30. Well, we got married at 29, so I'm forgetting my yeah, we got married at 29, engaged at 28, married at 29. So, yeah, the kids' conversation came in around 28, 29. That was when we started to have the serious conversation about children. But before then it was just yeah, in the future, but it just seemed like the future just getting kept getting closer and closer, like really fast.

SPEAKER_01: 12:49

So before I knew it, we were getting married, and then that's when when you say it was starting to um be really close, like the future was now. Yeah, was that excitement the future is now? Was that a bit nervousness? What was a bit of a bit of anxiety? What was it like?

SPEAKER_00: 13:09

I think it was more it was it was more excitement, definitely excitement, loads and loads of excitement. But at the same time, you know, you I was thinking, even at the age of 29, I was thinking gosh, there's so many things I would have wanted to do as well. Um, but I would have never have stopped wanting to get married and start a family. But I did think, oh gosh, I wish I'd kind of done this and this.

SPEAKER_01: 13:33

What would what what was on your mind?

SPEAKER_00: 13:35

What would you have done? Yeah, so just like having time, moving abroad, yeah, visiting more places, though those were kind of the things on the list. There was more, more that, probably more seeing the world is what was on my mind more than anything else.

SPEAKER_01: 13:48

Was it because for you it was a case of once the kids are here, we sort of move into the family frame, the family structure that I know um or that I've experienced myself as a child, and that doesn't really happen, or what was the reason for it?

SPEAKER_00: 14:07

I think um it was more that knowing that I could still do these things, but it wouldn't be carefree. Yes. That's all. So I know I could well these things that I wanted, I could still do them, but it wouldn't be how it would be without children.

SPEAKER_01: 14:21

It would be a different experience.

SPEAKER_00: 14:22

It would be a whole different experience, that was it, and just getting my head around that. But it's the the pros and cons always weighed in favour of starting a family. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 14:33

Fair enough. Right. So you're in your very early 30s and you made the decision to go ahead and start a family. How quickly did you um get pregnant?

SPEAKER_00: 14:43

Oh, straight away.

SPEAKER_01: 14:44

Okay, yeah, really straight away. Again, was that excitement or was it a bit of oh I didn't think it was gonna happen that quickly?

SPEAKER_00: 14:51

Yeah, I did not think it was gonna happen that quickly. Yeah, I would think I yeah, it was it was straight away, super quick. And yeah, we just got married. So we got married in the February, and then we conceived in April. Oh wow So it was like really quick, yeah, like pretty much straight away for us. So yeah, it was excitement because we always wanted kids, but things weren't at the time lined up how we would have probably expected. I think we'd put an offering to a property and it hadn't happened yet, and you know, things at work and just things, but then at the time I always knew that things would always work out, but yeah, it happened really quickly, and yeah, we definitely had like our anxieties, but I think you just would at any age, wouldn't you? Probably regardless, you having a kid, you know your life is about to change dramatically, so yeah, but it was more excitement because it's something I always wanted, and it was happening like whoa. So, how was that first pregnancy? Um, yeah, the pregnancy was a good one. I'm really, really thankful for it. Um, I I I had a really easy pregnancy for my firstborn son. Really, really easy pregnancy, really smooth. I was I was full of energy, still able to kind of manoeuvre. I worked all the way up until pretty much the end, going into the office five days a week, which is what we would do pre-COVID, pregnant, not pregnant, whatever, you're in the office. So I was still kind of able to just enjoy life. And yeah, I had a I had a good pregnancy. I had a few friends around who also either just had children or were pregnant at the same time. It was my mum and dad's first grandchild.

SPEAKER_01: 16:46

So you were the first in the end to have.

SPEAKER_00: 16:48

I was the first, yeah, 23 years later. So it was the first, I was the first grandchild. So I had loads of support from my family and my husband's family. They just think their um one of their sons, well, their only son, other son, sorry, he they just had a little boy as well. So it was like loads of children around. So it was just a really nice time, and yeah, pregnancy-wise, health-wise, yeah, it was a nice one. I was happy.

SPEAKER_01: 17:13

Okay. And so the baby comes. Yeah. What was it like once the baby was finally here?

SPEAKER_00: 17:20

Gosh, yeah. So that's where it all kind of changed. I think it was just surreal. That's the only way I can describe it. Once the baby came, it was just a s a surreal feeling. I still remember the minute he was put on my chest. And I remember it's gonna sound funny, but I remember him feeling like a hot chicken. Like a rotisserie chicken just was put on top of me. Just like a hot piece of material, like it just felt very thinking, is this my child? Um, and then yeah, the first couple of days were yeah, just cloud nine. The first couple of days had you know, family around. It was just like a dream. He was just so beautiful, so healthy, and it was amazing. But then I feel like it was the third day where now, obviously, with experience, I know I don't think I read many books at the time. I didn't know what was happening, I didn't really pay attention to what actually happens after you have a baby. All I knew is that I had so much knowledge about pregnancy. I'm somebody I'm a big researcher, but I researched the heck out of pregnancy, hypnobirthing, all of that. So I had that all down, but I didn't do any post-baby research. So the third day, woke up in the night, had the hot sweats, and my breasts were really hard. And then spoke to a friend, spoke to my mum. They're like, that's the milk coming in. I was like, okay. But then my mood just plummeted, just went straight to the floor. And I'm very lucky that I've I always have like mental health-wise, I've always been pretty lucky. My mental health has always been great. But at that moment, I didn't, I could just I just knew this just was not me. I just felt like so down, and I didn't know what it was. And that was now what I know was the baby blues, and it just came out of kind of nowhere, but I know now what it was. It was hormones and the hormones when they dropped. When they started, it yeah, and that was kind of an instruction like, yeah, this isn't this isn't gonna be as easy as it has been. Welcome.

SPEAKER_01: 19:34

Yeah, yeah. Was it was it um were you that lucky as well that it sort of worked as well with maybe your baby having a bit of a hectic night that that third night? Because it can happen that what's that? Oh, you've never heard of that. Oh, so that's something that can happen too. That um first um couple nights, your baby is sort of still trying to understand where they are, they're they're sleepy. Goodness, yeah. But then when you hit the third or fourth night, they know what's going on, all of a sudden it the it kind of hits them. So on your side, you've got the Holman drop. Yeah. And it's like, oh my god, what's happening? And you're not yourself anymore. And for the baby, it's kind of I don't know if it's a sense of panic or I don't know what it is, but um just kind of getting conscious and realizing they're not in the womb.

SPEAKER_00: 20:24

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, and then they just hits, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 20:27

It can be pretty terrifying if you don't know what to expect.

SPEAKER_00: 20:31

No, probably, probably. I can't even remember it now, but I know that my son was up all the time. Naturally, he's newborn. Um, and yeah, the first few nights, uh, babies are usually sleepy, as you say, and that's that is true. Thinking back, they're always just drowsy, aren't they? Yeah, by the third night, they're a bit more alert. So I I do remember waking up all the time, but the that probably correlates to that time frame where it was just knackering, yeah, plus the breast as well. And I think it took some time before, yeah, it took time for them to go down. What did you do about that?

SPEAKER_01: 21:05

Do you remember?

SPEAKER_00: 21:06

Did you when I had so I um I remember I had a an appointment, like health visitor appointment. We know that one of those appointments that you go to like three, four days in, and I'd told her what was happening, and she had ex um explained about this is a time where you express, had my mum there as well. She's like, This is when you express. Um and I was asked to go into the bar and just put some hot flannels on the breast. And then, yeah, the milk kind of came out that way, and then I did a bit of expressing as well, and then yeah, just kept the baby close. Yeah, and then that's kind of how they went down, but it did take a couple of days, it was painful, but yeah, yeah, it was painful. But they did kind of I wouldn't say they completely regulated because I always had quite a lot of production, so I did have that, yeah, had that quite a lot, but it wasn't anything like the first the first time.

SPEAKER_01: 21:59

So you decided to breastfeed your son?

SPEAKER_00: 22:02

Yeah, so I breastfed him. What was it like? Yeah, I I've yeah, and I loved it, like I really enjoyed it. I it it was probably one of my favorite things of having a baby was just the breastfeeding. Like I I and I was so confident, like I didn't care, I would do it anywhere. Like I felt so confident in it, and it just clicked. But I do remember the first day I had him and I was in the hospital, and then they kind of put put him on the breast, and they're like, Yeah, time to breastfeed. I'm like, Yeah, okay. So I was breastfeeding, and then I put him down, and I genuinely didn't believe I had any milk. And but I just pretended. I'm like, yes, yes, okay, just breastfed him. And then just once there was this a nurse, I think she just just came around and I said to her, you know what? I I don't think I have any milk. And I said, I'm feeding this baby, but I don't know if this baby's getting anything because I don't have any. Like I my breasts were exactly the same because I'd just given birth. So then she told me to, you know, put she asked me to put my palm on the front of my top of my nipple and like circle it around and then squeeze it, and then you see the the bit of um liquid come out. Yeah, it's it's called closum. Yes, yes, yeah, closum. The liquid came out. She's like, that's colostrum. So you don't have milk yet, but this is what the baby needs. It's very high in fat, blah, blah, blah, blah. And she explained it to me. I was like, I did not know. Did not know what that was. I missed that. So I just didn't do much research about the post-baby stuff. I just, I didn't. So everything from then was just learning day to day, literally learning on the job, as you say.

SPEAKER_01: 23:38

But I think it's quite common that women on their first pregnancy that they research a lot. The you know, you will attend classes and everything, but everything is going to be about before the baby comes. You don't really have much from what happens after.

SPEAKER_00: 23:54

Yeah, because it's such a big event leading up to labor. It's a massive event. And where we've all got our anxieties about labor, however, you're however you're choosing to have the baby, whether you're having elective C-section, emergency C-section, you're going for natural, whether you're going for epidural, we all know that this massive thing in us is going to come out somehow. Yes. And it's not going to be easy. So that is that kind of occupies a lot of time in terms of thought process. So for me, yeah, that was where my head was at. But once that whole thing was over, it was like, okay, I have this baby now. Okay, right. What do I do? But it I think what I didn't realize is just how much my body would change and what the healing would look like, and mentally what that would look like for me. I think all of that was just a shock for me.

SPEAKER_01: 24:45

What was it like then mentally, emotionally for you?

SPEAKER_00: 24:49

So yeah, so I think after the first, so the first three once I had the baby blues, I remember just walking around. I remember we went to my mum was over, and me and my husband just went for a walk, and I just remember feeling really down. And I and I think I probably felt like that for about a day, and I hadn't said anything. Because culturally, as well, part of it is you've had a baby, you should really like you should quote unquote be happy, very grateful you've had a healthy child. So I didn't want to say anything to kind of bring a downer almost. But then when I was going, I went for a walk with my husband and I said to him, like, I feel really low. Like I was happy two days ago, but I really feel really low now. And everything kind of hit me all at once. I just started to think, this is very final. There's no going back. Like everything, it's almost like it was like a light switch. Like life has changed now. All everything I started to think about was my priority is no longer myself. We're never going to be the same again. Like, we're now three. It just all came to me with it. It it was so overwhelming, the thoughts that just came to my head. So I had that, and then I yeah, and then that was kind of the baby blues. After I spoke to my husband about it, genuinely, when they say a problem shared is a problem halved. Like I felt so much relief just speaking to him, and I'm so I will be forever grateful for him for that conversation because it just felt so relieved. Um, and he just kind of said things like supportive, like, you're doing such a good job, like just you know, just continue, keep going, we're doing this together, we're in this together, what you need, you know, that kind of thing. So I'm really grateful for that, but it was still um, I still had those feelings, but then I think as time progressed, I only now realised that I also had like real strong anxiety as well, which I think I've always been a bit of an anxious person, not really knowing it, but I think I have had a bit of anxiety. But when I had the baby, it was like times times 20, yeah, like quite a lot of anxiety, which was yeah, again, just a shock.

SPEAKER_01: 27:00

What did it feel like?

SPEAKER_00: 27:02

So I had okay, so I said before that I used to work in PR and I used to always look at newspapers, always reading newspapers. That was part of my job. And probably all the things I've intaked over the years, you've seen the good, the bad, the ugly. I could read it all. Never affected me. I could read the most horrible story, but had before having children, it just wouldn't affect me. I'd say, God, that's awful. Turn the page. But I remember reading a newspaper and just seeing something about a child, and I just started breaking down. I remember it was nighttime. I think I was looking on you know BBC on my phone, and I just broke down. Just thought to myself, my God. Then I started to just the thought process was this this baby's been given, like not given to me, but I've had this baby, this, and I'm in charge of this baby. But this is so weird. Like, you don't even get qualifications for this. Like they, I'm just trusted with a baby. Like, pe everybody's trusted with a baby. People could be cuckoo and be trusted with baby. So it was just those thoughts, and then I just started to think, God, I could never leave him with anybody. It was like that, just feeling super protective. But the thoughts just always thinking, God, I hope nothing bad happens to him, and I just always need to be next to him. And that was kind of where the anxiety kind of started, I think, for me.

SPEAKER_01: 28:20

So, with that in mind, um what was it like in the early days, say maybe the first the first month or so when you went back home? Yeah. What was it like? First, was your husband with you at home?

SPEAKER_00: 28:34

Yeah, yeah, yeah. He was with me. He had three weeks off, which was helpful. And then I had my mum and also my mother-in-law. So I had quite a lot, like I didn't I didn't have to do much in terms of like look after babies, so that was really helpful. But I also um I think from two weeks in, I remember going to my first baby group with my mum. Wow. Because I just wanted to kind of get out of the house. You know, you've had a routine, you're having a big thing. Yeah, I remember just going to a baby group. I remember my first baby group, and we were just there in a circle. And I was like, Yeah, this is my son, he's two weeks. They were all like, whoa. But I just wanted to get out and like meet other mums and just be around other people that were in the same bubble as me. And um yeah, the first month was it was really yeah, it was just up and down, I think, for me. Mainly good and lucky that I had so much support, but at the same time, I think, yeah, uh I struggled with like the nights because I was exclusively breastfeeding. My husband could only really help with moral support, or I would feed and then give him the baby to settle, and then I would go back to sleep, but I would still be waking up and getting up and feeding. You know, when they're so small, you have to actually get up and properly feed them, opposed to when it's a toddler and you can just whip it out and go back to bed. That's what I would do with my toddler when they're older. I can just whip it out and go back to bed, but it was getting up, it was I found it such a struggle. Um, so yeah, I suffered with the night shifts, but there was times where I had my mum who had stayed over a few times, where she would take the baby. That was helpful. I had a few nights where I would express and give her the bottle of milk, but then that was helpful after about four hours when I would wake up and my chest would be soaking, and then I would come downstairs and go and get the baby. She's like, Why are you coming to get the baby? Go and rest. I'm like, Well, my I can't because my my my breasts have exploded and they're paining me. So I have to now wake up. So even if I did have help, I would still have to take the baby.

SPEAKER_01: 30:47

That new body.

SPEAKER_00: 30:48

Yeah, that new body, and I couldn't go on my front. It was just oh gosh, what an experience.

SPEAKER_01: 30:59

Um, okay, so how long was your maternity leave with your son, with your first son?

SPEAKER_00: 31:05

First son, it was about 14 months, I think I took.

SPEAKER_01: 31:09

14 months, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 31:10

14 months. How it's quite a long one.

SPEAKER_01: 31:12

Yeah, lovely. Oh, was it actually him saying that? But how how was it?

SPEAKER_00: 31:17

Oh, I I loved it. I I enjoyed it. I loved maternity leave. Um, the first maternity leave. It was it was a nice experience. I used to go to loads of baby groups, met loads of mums. I just wanted to be with him. I didn't want to go back to work. I just wanted to just be with him. So you lived up to what you had in mind. Yeah, yeah. I really, really enjoyed it. And yeah, by the time he was yeah, when he was about a year, that's when I started to go back to work. And I found that transition hard. But yeah, it was 13 months, 14, 13 months I took off.

SPEAKER_01: 31:55

What was it like then going back to work? What so I was tough. Especially because you mentioned earlier you had um strong anxiety when he was just born, um, and thinking I could never leave him with anyone. What was it like then when you went back to work? What what did you do with him? Where did he go?

SPEAKER_00: 32:11

So he was with my mum for the first few, for the first few months, and then he went to nursery. And it took me ages. I think I I literally looked at all the nurseries around the area, like three times. The nursery that he went to, I looked at when he was about four months, and I'd been there several times, and they used to make jokes. They're like, every time you come, he's like bigger and bigger and bigger. I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna check this place out until he is ready to come. So they used to just laugh at me, but I I loved that nursery. So he went there two days a week, and then he was with my mum, I think, for the other two days or something like that. I can't remember the arrangement, but yeah, it was. I think by the time I went back to work, I didn't have as much anxiety with leaving him as I did when he was under six months, six months and under when he wasn't on any foods. By then, he was walking, he was talking, he was bashing, throwing things. I felt sorry for whoever was looking after him by that point. I was like, you guys okay? Has he you guys survived him today? Opposed to when he was younger, and he just felt like he was so vulnerable. No, by that time, yeah, take him. He was a toddler. And so, um, at what point did you start thinking about baby number two? So, baby number two, we always wanted them to be around two years apart. So I think uh by the time Lucas was one, that's when we wanted, we're thinking about having another one. And then yeah, we yeah, we conceived, like again, straight away. Oh wow, which wasn't that we yeah, again, it was a bit of a shocker because again, I had things in my mind that oh, it's probably gonna take a bit longer because I'm a bit older and this and that, had all these things. I know. So it would have been 30. Yeah, yeah, 32. Yeah. So I don't know, I again, these are things I'd probably looking back should not have been a worry. But at the time it was like, oh, will it will it take longer? Well, you never know with fertility, it could be fun. Exactly to be fair. Yeah, and I'd seen so much on secondary infertility where people have had children the first time, and then no problem second time round, what's happening, you know. But again, for for us, it happened straight away, which uh feel very blessed. And then, yeah, that's when we just had our second second son. So by the time he was born, my firstborn was only 22 months.

SPEAKER_01: 34:41

Okay, okay, so just under two years of time. Just under two years, yeah. Bang on well done, guys. Well, yeah, kind of yeah. For the two-year gap? Yeah, we did it, very well done. So, um, how was that second pregnancy this time around? Obviously, you had a toddler. Yeah, what was it like? Oh wow.

SPEAKER_00: 35:02

So mental health-wise, so much better. Yeah, because I kind of knew what to expect in terms of pregnancies. I didn't have as much anxiety, I didn't even think about the didn't think about the labor. Exactly. I didn't think about the labor. There was no reading books, there was none of that. It was just getting through. So I had my son, I think two days a week, he was at home with me. And I think he was with my father-in-law at the time, and yeah, nurseries. We just had a little bit of mishmash. Yeah, there was no time to think. Um, again, luckily, I was in good health, and it was exactly the same as my other pregnancy, health-wise, completely the same. But with the toddler, my goodness, it was it was a lot. Uh it was a lot like having an 18-month-old. He needed to go out every pretty much whenever I was with him, running after him. I think when I wanted to nap, always tired, but he didn't nap, and you can't really fall asleep with a toddler because you just don't know what's gonna happen.

SPEAKER_01: 36:08

So don't touch anything that could burn you cut. Oh my goodness. I'll just trust you, right? And if if if you wouldn't mind just also preparing dinner, that would be actually quite kind.

SPEAKER_00: 36:19

I remember there was a time where I think I would have been about seven months pregnant, and there was a few friends. I think one of my other friends was pregnant with her second, and as a joke, I'd gone into one of the meeting rooms at work, had did some work in there, but I just took a picture of myself with my head like on the desk, and I was like, This is me right now. Like, I was so knackered. Like, I'm in a meeting meeting room, and I could just sleep right now, like I could just fall asleep. But yeah, that it was it was definitely um yeah, interesting having the toddler, but yeah, health-wise, exactly the same. It was fine.

SPEAKER_01: 36:52

And then oh, briefly, actually, I was wondering how did you prepare your toddler for the arrival of um his sibling?

SPEAKER_00: 37:01

So the thing is, because he was only like 18 months, there wasn't really much of a preparation. The only thing that I did, I had to kind of wean him off the breast. That was the one thing I did do, I think, by the time. So there was a time when I was pregnant and breastfeeding, and people would say, Oh, he's not gonna want to breastfeed because the milk changes when you're pregnant and you breastfeed. So they kind of stop. He didn't, he didn't stop, didn't happen. He didn't mind it. He was like, Wow, this tastes different, but whatever. So, but we we ended up weaning him when he was about seven months, and I would speak about like baby and tummy, mummy's having a baby, but yeah, he did by the end of it, he was around, you know, go getting up to two, then it kind of clicked. But before then, there wasn't much. I didn't really buy books or anything like that. It was just kind of conversations about this is why mummy's belly's growing, there's a baby in there. Um, but yeah, not not loads of not loads of preparation.

SPEAKER_01: 37:59

And for you, um, what was your own preparation of thinking I've got one, we're gonna move to two. Yeah. What is that gonna look like?

SPEAKER_00: 38:07

Yeah, I was I was a bit panicked just because my older son at the time was really clingy, and I was just thinking, how am I gonna deal with a toddler who's clingy and a newborn? So uh we roped in family, like uh my father-in-law and my mum, and I did think of like pre-preparation, like prepping food, and we he was in nursery at the time, so there was things that we kind of prepared around it, but I still didn't anticipate it to be as hard as it was, so it wasn't as if I was like really thinking, okay, I really need to get things in place, so I didn't think it would be that hard in yeah, in retrospect, I was wrong, and so yeah, jumping after the birth, yeah, was it? It was the hardest thing. I have three kids, and I say to people with two when they have two young kids, I genuinely, in my experience, three kids is easier than having two. Yeah, it is easier, like that period. I think maybe the ages, even it to be honest, it's not even just the ages because sometimes when I'm alone with just my five-year-old and my two-year-old, that's harder than having all three of them. It's almost as if that's when there's two of them. Yeah, the group dynamic changes things. I feel like when there's two of them, they just fight for your attention or they fight each other. Like there's just always something going on with them. But when there's the three, it's like they be form a little, like a little tribe, almost.

SPEAKER_01: 39:37

They're a little society.

SPEAKER_00: 39:38

Yeah, something like that. There's always something with the three, but when there's just the two of them, and with the toddler and the baby, that was really tough.

SPEAKER_02: 39:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 39:47

On the I I remember thinking about the days when I'm on my own with them. I remember the first time I can remember the first time when I was on my own with them. My husband had just gone to the toilet, and I remember panicking. I'm like, don't be Long can we come with you? Yeah, I think at the time it must have been about six, he was about six days old. I hadn't been alone with him. He'd either taken the toddler, held the new book. But I remember when we were both in the all in the living room, he got up. Remember watching him walk. I was like, duh! Felt like I was alone in an ocean. I remember saying, could hurry up, hurry up. Oh gosh, it was interesting. But yeah, I definitely found that like really, really tough. I can't lie. That was hard.

SPEAKER_01: 40:30

So speaking about, you know, juggling and finding things difficult. Um, do you want to tell me about nights?

SPEAKER_00: 40:36

The nights. Yeah. So I think then the nights were the same as the before, you know, the waking up all the time. But my husband sorted out my toddler who also was waking up, but I wouldn't deal with him. So I was dealing with the nights. But the difference is with between one and two is that when I had my first one, I could nap when he napped. They say sleep when baby sleeps. Yeah, you can do that and you're okay, you can function. But when you have a toddler, there's no sleep when baby sleeps. There is none of that.

SPEAKER_01: 41:08

Because he doesn't sleep when baby sleeps.

SPEAKER_00: 41:10

He doesn't sleep. And if when he does have his nap, baby might be awake. So I was trying to sync up the some of the advice I had was try and sync up the kids' naps, which doesn't really happen until the kids are at least a few months, the the newborns a few months old. It's younger than that, they just sleep whenever. There's no sinking, in my experience. So, but then I still had to take my son to baby groups, still had to make sure he was like interacting. First one, sorry. First one, yeah. There was no baby groups for the second one. Sorry, it was just all about the first. He needed his energy burnt, and so I was just taking the newborn around with me, taking him to the park. And he was a really busy boy, so it was just kind of making sure that he was burning his energy. But then the tiredness that I thought I had before, I was laughing at myself. I was like, I used to think I was tired. This is just oh, I mean, I was, but I didn't know there was levels to it, didn't know you could be more tired. So it was, so it was, yeah, it was really pretty tough. I found it. But at the same time, it was when I look back at the pictures of the kids when they were so young, they it was some of the most magical times of my life. But when you're in it, you know, you're like, God, this is a lot. And I remember there was a lady from my church, and I was speaking to her. I was like, Oh my gosh, like, how am I gonna do this? And she said, You in a few months, the boys are gonna play together and they're not gonna care for you. You're they're gonna be playing their Lego and they're gonna have stints. Obviously, not very long, they're still under three. They're gonna have stints where they're just gonna play together and you're gonna have a breather. So, and I was like, Well, when? I mean, when? Like, how? Not today. It's not like, and I'm looking at two months. I'm like, when is that gonna happen? He's not gonna move for a while, but before you know it, like within a click, that's exactly what happened. The two of them would just be doing their thing together. I could have a cup of tea. So, yeah, it was just the early months, which it was just so intense. And the tea was still hot, the tea was still hot, good, but it was very close to me. Yes, very, very close to me. And when I saw somebody coming towards me, I'd have to be like, really quickly get up. Or I'd have to have them in front of me because you never know if one of them's gonna jump from behind.

SPEAKER_01: 43:22

Oh gosh. Be prepared, be prepared, guys. Okay, so this is two. So this is two. Um, and uh so let me try and remember now.

SPEAKER_00: 43:38

Yeah, so with lockdown happened as well during that pregnancy without with that um remember. So, yeah. So my son was born in December, and so the second son was born in December in 2019, yeah, and then three months later there was lockdown. Oh, I was finding it intense with the first three months, but I had support the first three months, it was still very intense. But I had my mum, I had nursery, I had my father-in-law who was looking after my firstborn like one day a week, and then all of a sudden, boom, nothing. I was like, Oh, you thought it was eat hard now then? How about this thing? Exactly, this thing called COVID, and then yeah, it was just me and the babies, and yeah, my husband was home. So, was he working from home? He was working from home, and so it was just the four of us at home, and yeah, those again, like looking back, yes, they were hard because I had small children, but they were magical in the same way. And then I remember looking in the news, how you know, comparing myself in in a healthy way in terms of you know, looking at other parents and what they're going through and seeing that I'm not alone, like other parents had teenagers or school children that they're having to homeschool and they're having to, you know, try and, you know, you've got kids that are not seeing their actual friends that they need to see their friends, or they're just feeling so isolated and going through all of those things. And people would say to me, even though you know, I saw people kind of doing things over lockdown, like painting. And I remember seeing um a celebrity on TV. I remember she had a baby at the same time as me. Remember having a um a bowl of soup. I think she was just, I think it was on her Instagram. I remember having a bowl of soup just talking to the camera. I was thinking, I can't have a bowl of soup. Like she's actually having soup. Yeah, I would love a bowl of soup. I couldn't have hot dishes like that at the time. I remember thinking I couldn't, I couldn't just have a bowl of soup. I'm always holding the baby. Yes, it's not, it wasn't safe. I remember thinking this is my life right now. I can't even have some of that soup.

SPEAKER_01: 45:47

The previous one. The ones they can have their hot soup.

SPEAKER_00: 45:52

But um, yeah, so then COVID came, and I think initially, obviously, I was like everybody else, panicked. Um, not it was unknown. But once we got into the swing of things, it was just the same routine every day going out for our one-hour day walks. Had the double buggy. By then, my son was yeah, four months, so he was completely alert, and we would just go for walks, go to the park, and that was what we pretty much did every day. And we lived for the weekends, like when my husband would be off, and then we would just go to like check out new forests. That was pretty much all we could do. So it was a it was a really testing time. Um, but I think during that period is where I just I just grew so much resilience as a mother. Like that there will there, I doubt there will be anything that was tougher than that time. I mean, I'm sure teenage parents probably will say, Oh, really? You wait for it. Yeah, exactly. You wait, or they're probably laughing at me now. But I think at the time they just built so much resilience during that time, but also just seeing the beauty in the moments as well. Because I felt that with my secondborn, I didn't um I felt like the time just went really fast compared to my firstborn, where I was taking all the pictures, doing my the one month, your how many weeks are you? Oh, he's uh 17 and a half weeks, and you know, you just get to have all those moments, but with the second born, I just felt like it just went really, really quickly. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 47:18

Fantastic. And so by the time COVID ends, is there the time when your firstborn starts preschool?

SPEAKER_00: 47:27

Yeah, that's it. Yeah, by the time he ended, he was in preschool and they were both in school at the time, and I'd gone back to work. And I remember the first time we went back to work, I was so anxious about going back. I didn't want to go back. For the second time round, I was so excited to go back. A bit of free time, a bit of free time. I couldn't wait, like I could not wait because we were all still working from home. And I think the first time, you know, it's like your your child is going off on his own to nursery, but because the boys were so close in age, they were going together. Yeah, so it didn't feel I didn't feel for my second ball like I'm taking him to a whole brand new nursery. I knew the nursery, I knew the staff so well. It was just we they were like our family, so it was just like he was just going to his family, and then we had my father-in-law as well, so they just went to their grandads. So, in terms of childcare, there was no anxiety towards the childcare, that was fine. But I just got a complete breather, and I'm yeah, when I look back, I'm just so thankful that I did have work to kind of go back to. And at the before when I had my first pregnancy, I didn't appreciate that.

SPEAKER_01: 48:33

Did you have anything else um in your life that was sort of your time and your time only outside of work? Like, I don't know, did you have sports? Did you have um going out with friends? Yeah, did you have anything that you were able to bring back into your life at this point, especially after COVID? I think you know a lot of us were just desperate to go back out.

SPEAKER_00: 48:54

Um, did you have any of that? Yeah, so I used to go to the gym like pretty much every lunchtime, like go to classes, like I loved it. For runs, used to go for a run in the morning. That was like my time after school in the morning? Well, after school run, we'd the book my husband would do the school run, and then I would do my run. Okay, and then I'd have my first meeting. Everybody in my team at the time were doing running in the morning. That was like everyone's thing. Wow. So we would all kind of don't do that anymore, but we would come back to the case. I was gonna ask, yeah, no, not anymore. But we used to all come to our meeting and we'd all like have had our run and we had the hap and everything, and then yeah, gym in the afternoon, and then seeing friends was not as often, unless it was weekends, so that was kind of seldom, but yeah, the only time I really had was just time out in terms of gym, but then we were all working from home at the time, so I still had you know pretty much four days of quiet time, yeah, which was yeah, very welcomed.

SPEAKER_01: 49:51

And so at what point did you decide that you wanted to grow the family a little bit more?

SPEAKER_00: 49:57

Yeah, so we uh decided that we wanted a bit of a bigger gap this time. We didn't want to do two years again.

SPEAKER_01: 50:06

We uh what was the reason?

SPEAKER_00: 50:08

Well, it was mainly I'd say financial. Like I wanted to get a better job. I wanted to get a promotion, move departments, or like get a new job altogether. So that was part of the reason why was just I I wanted, we we wanted, I wanted to get another job before we thought about having another baby. So that was mainly the reason. Um, so that wasn't happening until then. So that's kind of how that happened. Okay, well, fair enough.

SPEAKER_01: 50:35

Very good. Did you get the job? I did, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 50:37

Congrats. Got the job, and then we were like, right, here we go. It's back on.

SPEAKER_01: 50:41

Okay, and how quickly did that happen this time?

SPEAKER_00: 50:44

Yeah, it was the same. Very quick. Okay, yeah, the same again. It was it was quick. Um, I yeah, I had been on like a different contraceptive this time around. Um, and I was on a coil this time around when before I was on the pill. So I yeah, took it out and same thing, kind of assumed that it would take a bit longer. Didn't kind of know I'd never had a coil before, so I didn't know whether it would be instant or it would take some time. And yeah, for me, that's how it happened.

SPEAKER_01: 51:10

So you and your body reacted exactly the same.

SPEAKER_00: 51:12

Yeah, so it was just exactly the same. So it happened straight away, which again, very thankful for. And then that's how that happened. So by then, by then, my son, younger son was two, and then my older son was three and a half.

SPEAKER_01: 51:25

I was still very young.

SPEAKER_00: 51:27

Yeah, well, he was four, sorry, four and two and two when we fell pregnant with the third born. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 51:32

Okay. And so how was the pregnancy this time around?

SPEAKER_00: 51:36

Yeah, it was very different. Um I think early on I knew I was having a girl. Yeah, yeah, because it was just completely different. The first two pregnancies fli were easy, but this time around, as soon as I was pregnant, I couldn't eat, felt sick, I I couldn't stand food. It was so bad. I hadn't I didn't get to I didn't eat for days. I would try, but I would just want to throw up. Times I did throw up, it was yeah, found it really tough this time round. So I just knew I was like, this my boys didn't do this to me. Didn't do this to me. It's got to be a girl, it's gotta be a girl. It has to be a girl, and it and it was, but I just knew straight away. So the pregnancy was was a lot different. I still um I think by the time I got into my second trimester, everything kind of settled down. But the first trimester I I found really, really rough, really tough um in comparison, or just always sleeping. I think there was a time where I remember I went to put my one of the toddlers down for a nap, and my husband had gone to put the other one down. By the time he'd come into the room, and um I was asleep, I fell asleep before he did. And my husband was like, my son was like, Shh, mummy's having a nap. I was so kidding. My husband was like, Are you putting him down or is he putting you down? I'm like, both.

SPEAKER_01: 52:56

The little gentleman though, mummy's sleeping.

SPEAKER_00: 52:59

Mummy's having a sleep. She's tired.

SPEAKER_01: 53:02

You probably were exhausted. Oh. So um second trimester onwards, things were good?

SPEAKER_00: 53:12

Yeah, it was things were things were good, but I think um with this pregnancy, I had a lot of anxiety, like so much anxiety, but it was about the health of the baby. It was just yeah, it was just sorry. What why is that? I don't, I couldn't even tell you. Like Did you have any reasons to No, I didn't have any reason. I just had from the moment I found out I was pregnant, it was like, is this baby gonna be okay? And I never had that before. Um I remember we went for an early scan just because I and before the 12-week one, just to check if everything was okay. And I remember once they showed us the baby, the baby was like 10 weeks, and I remember just breaking down crying. And they were like, Is that happy tears? I'm like, Yes, yes. I just I hadn't been able to sleep, I didn't know whether the baby was okay. And unfortunately, that kind of traveled through throughout the pregnancy. I was just always super duper anxious, just purely for the health of the baby. Um, I remember, you know, I'm so thankful for like social media because you get to see different people's accounts and experiences, and thankful for like podcasts and stuff like that, where you realize you're not alone. And I remember there was another like social media influencer saying she had, I think, at the time, like six kids, and her last kid, she was just anxious for the health, and she'd never had that before. So that was just my experience of just just feeling like, is the baby gonna be okay? So I put it down to just again, just an anxiety because I didn't have any health concerns. I was never told that there was anything wrong with the baby. It was just myself, really. So, how did that translate? Did you go for extra scans? Did you I thought I thought I would have extra scans because sorry, because I'm I at the time I was 30, just turned 35. So I thought when you're 35, you're geriatric pregnant pregnancy. Oh, that's right. That's what I thought. Well, that's what I thought that was what you were. So that's what I that's what I knew. I thought, okay, 35. So when I had my first scan, I was like, okay, so how many do I get this time? Because the last time I only got two. So are you gonna give me like one every month? And she was like, why would I do that? Like, because I'm 35. She was like, so what? I was like, aren't I, but aren't I geriatric? She was like, no. We go by the health. So if there's something, you know, if there's a health concern, you can have more, but there's nothing wrong with your health. And yeah, 35, we don't consider that like geriatric. I'm like, oh, oh. So there's nothing that I didn't get anything extra. She's like, no. I'm liking this midwife. I don't know her, but I like her. Yeah, I was like, okay, but I was hoping that I would have extra scans just because I was so anxious. I wouldn't have cared with my other two pregnancies, but for this one, I really could have done with them. But no, there wasn't any anything extra. It was just the standard. Yeah. Did you go privately? Only for the first scan. Okay. Only for this first scan. I was considering doing a uh one in the one in five month scan, but I went in the end, we just didn't have time. So that's the reason why we didn't. I probably would have.

SPEAKER_01: 56:02

Yeah, it probably helped the fact that you probably didn't have that much time. Yes, yes, we did the other two running around.

SPEAKER_00: 56:08

Exactly. I think I probably if I had it my way, I probably would have been one of those people that would just have a Doppler just to check if the baby was okay. I don't think that would have helped me. I don't think it would have, because you know you can never be updated on a child's heartbeat because unless you're checking every second. Um but yeah, I I I ended up not and just trusting in God and just having to do like a lot of prayer and just calming my nerves and calming my mind for it. I almost felt like there was a point in the pregnancy where I didn't even feel like I could get excited until she was actually here. Because I was just still so anxious to that point until yeah, until she was actually here. I didn't feel like I could celebrate much. So yeah, that was again just how how the anxiety kind of transpired.

SPEAKER_01: 56:55

Were you able to um is that a conversation you had with any professionals like your GP or your midwife? Is that circumversation you I didn't know?

SPEAKER_00: 57:08

I think it was no, I didn't. And I looking back, I probably could have had a conversation, but I didn't. But I do know that there was times where I would just wake up in the night and literally look at the scan and just be like, oh my god, I hope baby's okay. Um so I knew that I was like more anxious because again, this is my third pregnancy, never had these kind of feelings before, and nor has anybody said anything like you know, so I knew that it I I was very aware that it was my myself, if that makes sense. I knew it was my anxieties more than any anything else, because I was very aware of that, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01: 57:45

Yeah, no, that that makes complete sense. Yeah, so it was nothing sort of it was just a feeling. Yeah, exactly. A gut feeling, maybe anything. How was your um birth?

SPEAKER_00: 57:59

The birth, yeah. The birth was for the third born, um, it was a natural birth, and it was just a lot quicker. Yeah, but I would say the pain was just like four times as much as the others, but it was quicker. So there was a natural birth? It was yeah, it was a natural birth, um, and it was just a just literally a few hours. So it was probably out of all of the births, like I would say, even though it was the quickest, it was through the hardest. Oh wow, just because of just because of the pain.

SPEAKER_01: 58:28

I think the others because it just went from zero to a million in no time.

SPEAKER_00: 58:33

Yeah, my I I I was expecting it to be like the others were you know eight hours, one of them was like ten and a half, but it was like a gradual kind of pain where you could manage it. But by the time I'd got to the hospital, I was fine. But by the time, I think half an hour before then, it I it just went from zero to ten, where the others it was just you know, step by step. So by the time I got to the hospital, I went to the birth centre, but there was no um, I wasn't eligible for like any kind of pain relief by that point because I was so progressed. Yeah, I wanted to go into the pool, the plan was to go into the pool. They were like, We don't think you're gonna make it into the pool because we don't think we think the baby will be here before. And I was like, Can you can you fill it up anyway? Like we could fill it up anyway, but it takes like 45 minutes or half an hour. I'm like, we'll do it anyway. Um, and I remember asking for all these different things. I'm like, can I have pethidine? They're like, no, you're too far gone. I'm like, can have this, can I have that? Can I have that? Can I have epidural? They're like, you can't. And I'm like, no, what can I have? They're like paracetamol. I'm like, give that to me. Did it help? I could I couldn't, I didn't take it. I couldn't even, I just couldn't take it. Um, they had gas and air there, but I couldn't, by the point I'd got there, there was nothing I could have except just breathing. But once she was here again, absolutely fine. It's just up until that point was just like bang, bang, bang.

SPEAKER_01: 59:50

Okay, I'm with you. Um what about your boys? How did you prepare them for the arrival of that new baby?

SPEAKER_00: 59:56

So I think that was a lot easier. We had um we have the boys. We allow them to be part of the whole journey. We told them 12 weeks. That was the time we told them that we're pregnant when we were 12 weeks, so quite early. Because at the time they were like two and a half and four and a half. They could kind of understand things. And also because they're quite boisterous boys, we needed them to know what was happening to mummies. So nobody comes and jumps on my stomach as they kind of do like step over me and things like that. And just so that they can just be a bit softer with me. I don't know if that came out. Yeah, just to prepare them. So we you know we did a gender reveal with just the just the five of us or four of us at the time, you know, to show them what's gonna be a boy or a girl, and so they knew it was gonna be a girl. Um so we kind of kept them like updated and they remember it even till now, and I had to had the belly and everything. So we just kind of kept them like part of the part of the process, yeah, if that makes sense. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:56

Okay, and so how was it once baby was here? Baby girl then, yeah, first girl in the family, first girl, um, and also your child that is that has the same position in the family as you.

SPEAKER_00: 1:01:10

Yes, oh yeah, the girl, that's actually yeah, true. Sometimes I don't think about those things, but yeah, she is, she's the same position, last born as me, yeah. So very similar, baby girl. But I'm very aware of what you know, trying to not allow their birth order position to define their character. I'm quite big on those things because I know that there's so much pros and cons to the different birth orders. So there's a there's a book I've read, um, it's called Birth Order Blues by a lady called Mary Wallace, and it just talks about basically goes into depth of what I've said in terms of you know, the eldest child, you're more likely to be stricter on them. They always go first, and then the middle child might feel a bit more neglective, so they a bit more, you know, have a bit more of a playful personality, and then the younger one may get away with more, and how gender plays into it. So I've done, you know, I've read quite a lot of those things. So I do try and implement that in my parenting just to make sure every child shines, irrespective of where they are in the birth order. So that's kind of what I'm what we try and do anyway. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:02:20

And so what was it like going home now as a family of five? Um, your two boys, your little girl, what was it like all of a sudden you are outnumbered?

SPEAKER_00: 1:02:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:02:32

Uh yeah. What does that mean?

SPEAKER_00: 1:02:35

Yeah, it was it was so it was so special when we went home. I was only in for 24 hours, came home, and I remember my mum has always given me the advice of when you have a sibling that's getting, that's meeting their new sibling, to always have that baby try and have the baby not in your arms, try and have the baby like in a cot, somewhere away.

SPEAKER_02: 1:02:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 1:02:58

So I always did that, and we did that with her, and we did that with my second boys. We had them kind of go over to the baby, and they still remember that moment to this day where they remember her just in her little cart. Um, and yeah, it just brought a softness to the home. I remember the boys holding her, and but it was chaos at the same time because they don't really, they still have things to the kids that are still running around, and you have a newborn, and they the oldest was four and a half, so it's still quite a lot going on in the home. But we did again have my mum over there to help. Um, but one of the things I remember being quite conscious of is like the bonding between me and the baby. Because I remember with my second born, I felt that I didn't get to bond with him as much during the early days because I was so engrossed in the toddler. And that was something I was really conscious about with my third born, thinking, how am I gonna actually get to bond with her as much with all of this? But something ended up happening to me a few days in after I'd had her, I'd actually got admitted to the hospital. I'd got strep A. So I ended up staying in the hospital for an extra seven days or nine, seven, I think it's seven or eight days. I was in the hospital, so I wasn't around for Christmas because it was just in December. My son had his birthday then, it was Christmas, so I was in hospital, which would usually be a really testing time for people, for somebody in the right frame of mind. But for me, I I didn't feel very ill, even though I probably I was, but I just remember that time as just thinking, oh my god, it's just me and the baby. Like I was so shocked I even had a girl. So baby went to the hospital with you? Yeah, baby went to the hospital with me. She stayed with me the whole time. So it was just me and her, like every single day, every waking minute of the day. And I feel like the that period and that experience happened for a reason because God knew that I couldn't have bonded with her in that, in that, in the house of all the kids around. But just having that week with just unlimited time, not having to do anything, just having staff, you know, food, and you know, I'm not, didn't have any cleaning or anything to do, it was just us. I feel like that really solidified the bond between me and the baby. And I just don't think I would have had that. So even though the circumstances were no way ideal, no way would I choose that. However, the the outcome of that I think I will be forever grateful for. What's strep A? Um, it's an infection that you can that you get, but it can, if it goes into your blood, it can be at different parts of your body, but when it goes into your blood, it it you can get sepsis, which is can be fatal. Yeah. So it's it's it's pretty dangerous. How did you notice that something was off? I had heavy bleeding. Okay. And it was really heavy, but I still thought, okay, it'll be fine. And then I was in bed and my husband noticed me shivering. And that's when he was like, We've got to go to the hospital. I was like, no way. Like three, three days after having a baby, I've got two children at home. I'm okay. And he's like, Well, if we're not gonna go to the hospital, call call one-one one. And I called them and they were like, Yeah, just go in to check. And I was like, I really can't be bothered of going to the hospital. I've got three small kids, ended up dropping the two of my mother-in-laws, and then went into the hospital, and they kept me in a room. And I just remember thinking, God, it's really cold in here. Had my coat on, put my husband's coat on. I was like, it's really cold. And that's when they did the test and actually said, I can't leave. I've got strep strep A. And then they said it's actually progressed. Now it's in my blood.

SPEAKER_02: 1:06:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 1:06:45

And that's when it is really dangerous. Because if you, you know, once you have sepsis, if your body doesn't control it, it can be fatal. But I think at the time, again, another blessing, I didn't know what strep A was, and I didn't know how serious it was. Yeah, and honestly, ignorance is just the best thing because when you don't know, you can't panic. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:07:07

So I hadn't no idea. In this case, ignorance is it absolutely is.

SPEAKER_00: 1:07:10

So all I was thinking about is um the literally, she was just like a gem, just an angel. I just used to always just wake up and just stare at her. Just that was all I cared about. Every minute, I'm just like staring at this baby. They're like, Oh, yeah, we're checking your levels. I'm like, Yeah, yeah, yeah, go for it.

unknown: 1:07:25

Wow, I've got a daughter.

SPEAKER_00: 1:07:27

Wow. That's the only source of that's all I literally cared about for the last seven days. Was that when I think back about it? It's like a crazy experience, but that was what happened. It's a little while. So and that was just just over Christmas as well. Yeah, it was over Christmas. That's probably where it felt the hardest, is just when I thought I was gonna go out at Christmas, go back at Christmas. And I remember crying the first time I actually cried because I realized I wasn't gonna spend Christmas with the kids. And I remember I had this really lovely like porter who would come in and like clean and chat to me. And I remember her saying, Why are you crying? I said, Well, I thought I wanted to be home with the kids. And she's like, Didn't you say you had two boys? They were like four and two. I was like, Yeah. She goes, Please, you go home. Okay, when you go home, you'll be like, take me back to the hospital. I can't take, take me back. She was like, So stay here until you're you're really you're ready to go home. Because if you're not ready to go home, you'll want to come back. So I remember that just made me laugh and just realize that you know what, let me just get better. So you went home, went back home after Christmas? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, went home, but went back home at Christmas and I yeah, felt strong. Um, I would have, I used to have like I made a whole bunch of what was it called? broth. I made loads of broth, like beef beef broth. What was it called? Beef broth? Like beef bone broth. Like loads of that. And I remember that's what I used to have every single day, like just a glass of that, because it just replenishes all your nutrients. There was a book that I read the first 40 days, and they recommended having that after birth. It's good for your breastfill meal, it's just good for replenishing the mother's, all your nutrients. And it has um, it's a really lovely book, and it it's a lovely illustrative book as well. It talks about all the meals that you need for different parts of postpartum. So I followed that. And yeah, that I think having the good diet, when I look back at the pictures of myself after I've come out of hospital, like I look better than I did when I had my firstborn. Like I feel like how I nourished myself and the knowledge I had and my past experience kind of knew how to look after myself and also knew what support I needed. I wasn't really shy about asking for what I needed and not doing what I couldn't. What sort of support did you ask for? So, my I had the kids in nursery, but up the days for the younger one. I had my father-in-law looking after the younger one as well. Um, I would call on my mum whenever she was free. I'd be like, look, just come round. You take the kids, my husband as well. I just use him as much support as possible. Whenever he had time, he would take the baby from me, give me a nap, let me have a nap. Or take, you know, just any any kind of support I would have. I had um one of my really good friends didn't live round, didn't live far at the time. So she would kind of come round, keep me company if I need to have a nap, she was there. So I would just kind of do anything I could to just give myself a bit of a break.

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:32

Yeah. Getting your village around.

SPEAKER_00: 1:10:34

Yeah, getting the village exactly. I think nothing was more important at the time than village.

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:39

Yeah. Yeah. I like that. Yeah. Obviously. I like that. Um, so now we are two and a half years later. Yeah. Almost three years later. Yes.

SPEAKER_00: 1:10:53

What's it like? Oh, it's it's so much karma now. Then it still is busy because we still have children that are under 10. Our youngest is seven. I think the hardest thing now is the rushing around. I feel like I'm constantly going somewhere for the kids, dropping them at this activity to that activity to homework. The easiest one is the baby because she, you know, there isn't, we're not doing any activities for her at the moment. It's just kind of the older boys. So that's really um, that's really the part that's a lot for us. But it's funny because I can have all the kids at home with me, and none of them are actually in the same room as me. They just want to be with each other. So I'm now having more time. I have to come in and be like, hi guys. Like, does anyone want to hang out? They're like, no, we're actually doing this, or we're we're playing pirates. So it's we have so much more space. So me and my husband can just like hang out together when before yeah, when before it was one hanging off this here, one hanging off there, and it happened so fast, happened so quickly. You know, two and a half years ago or two years ago, my life was just really intense with really small kids. But fast forward two years later, and they're still really young, don't get me wrong, they're still small kids. But once they're walking and talking and they want to do their own little thing, as a parent, you just you you do get your space back, like it comes back before you know it. You you have that bit of space, so that's kind of where we where we are now. So we do have our challenges in terms of raising your children. That that is not ever going to be easy, and even if that doesn't take up time, you you need to do it right. So that is hard in itself. But in terms of like physically and waking up at night and you know, the drain on your body, you don't we don't have that anymore.

SPEAKER_02: 1:12:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:12:55

I think we've got to the end of your story, probably. Is there anything else you want to add? Anything else you feel like you would have loved to know all those seven years ago, five years ago, three years ago?

SPEAKER_00: 1:13:09

Yeah. I think what I would want wish what I wish I could have told myself then is just to enjoy the journey and just take it easy and speak out for anything you might need. You know, not to compare yourself or try and be the perfect mother, just enjoy your children because they grow so quickly. That's probably what I would have told myself back then, and not to be stressing and anxious and just take your time and just enjoy it. That's probably what I would tell myself.

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:44

I'm loving that. I'm loving that. And I think that it's probably gonna give some hope to some parents who are in the midst of it. Yeah, um, who are thinking, at what time can I have my bowl of soup?

SPEAKER_02: 1:13:57

Hot bowl of soup.

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:59

Hot tea. Or hot tea. You know those things. When when will that come back? But it does come back. It does quicker than you thought it would.

SPEAKER_00: 1:14:06

Yeah, exactly. Before you know it, they're they they they're grown. So you just have to enjoy that time and not to compare yourself. I think I had so much struggle with comparing. You know, you'd hear somebody's child at six months is sleeping through the night. That used to really get to me.

unknown: 1:14:23

I'm like, what?

SPEAKER_00: 1:14:24

I've got like a nine-month, ten-month, eleven-month-old who's not sleeping through the night. And you know, or somebody is, you know what I mean? Like people are in different, their, they, their motherhood is very different than yours. You can see a parent that she's had a child maybe two months ago, she's out partying, looking amazing, but then you don't know. She could be going through postpartum depression. You have no idea. And that's the things that transpired later where I would compare myself. Some people be like, How is she looking so amazing and going out and this and that? And I've realized that a person actually was going through a situation, but you wouldn't know those things by looking at it, and you stupidly compared yourself, thinking you're the same. So those are the things I would just tell myself. Um, and it gets easier.

SPEAKER_01: 1:15:09

I love it. I love it. So that's probably the end then for today.

SPEAKER_00: 1:15:14

Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01: 1:15:16

Thanks so much for sharing your story. I loved it. Like I said, I think it's probably gonna give some hope to um lots of new parents or not also new parents. Um, but it's just that yeah, things change, um, they move on, yeah, enjoy what you have, and um, you know, be strong uh when the changes are sent um your way. Absolutely. Thanks so much, Candida. Speak to you soon. Bye. Bye. Thank you so much for listening. Today's conversation took us through her lifelong longing to becoming a mother, the fears that shaped her twenties, and the joy and surprise of watching her children grow out of babyhood far sooner than she ever imagined. Suddenly, there she was, able to enjoy a warm ball of sip again, a quiet reminder of how quickly those early years pass. If you'd like to explore anything we mentioned, you'll find all the details in the show notes. And as always, thank you for being here with me on Raising with the Village, where every story shows just how much we learn, grow, and rediscover ourselves through parenthood. You've been listening to Raising with the Village. If you're enjoying these conversations, don't forget to subscribe on your favorite podcast platform, whether that's Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, or Deezer, so you never miss a new story. New episodes come out every Thursday. You can also find us on Instagram at raising with the Village or on our website at raisingwith.co.uk, where you'll find more about the project and past episodes. If you have a story to share about parenting, step parenting, or just navigating family life, I'd love to hear from you. You can get in touch through the website or send a message on Instagram. Because every story shared helps another parent you've seen, heard, and supported. Until next time, bye bye.